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Bench PressChestSplit Advice

3 years, still haven't found chest routine14969

musclesbrah24 private msg quote post Address this user
Every muscle besides chest, I have found the volume, frequency, weight that makes it grow. For example, my shoulders grow very well on drop sets.

Recently, I have really been focusing on flies. The reason being is that the main function of the chest is to adduct the arms the midline of the body. The contraction of bench press can never compare to the contraction of a fly even with perfect form. And we all know that there is no upper/lower/inner/etc. chest. So I mainly stick with just flat for everything. Before anyone says that my form is probably off. I assure it is on point. I am at a total loss.
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nine0seven private msg quote post Address this user
I can contract my chest on a bench press ... umadbro?
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musclesbrah24 private msg quote post Address this user
@nine0seven never said I couldn't contract my chest on bench press, the contraction is just inferior to the fly
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
I made a thread about this a few days ago
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THE GODFATHER wannabemuscular private msg quote post Address this user
@musclesbrah24 Have you tried "bending the bar" when you bench?

Or when you do pushup, try to push your hands together into the floor, if you get what I'm saying.
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WinnersNeverQuit private msg quote post Address this user
@wannabemuscular bending the bar?
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brian12 private msg quote post Address this user
@WinnersNeverQuit he means intension . I think he means pushing the bar inwards, but your hands dont move to create more tension. He is sleep deprived so probably didnt mean to use the word bending. Haha
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brian12 private msg quote post Address this user
@musclesbrah24

i suggest normall dumbbell press on flat bench in the 6-10 rep range. If you are continuosly profressing (weight or reps etc), yoyr chest will 100% grow (presuming u are eating in surplus)
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
While the contraction may not be as good as with a press, you'll never be able to handle enough weight with a fly vs a press. When you're bench pressing you ARE adducting the arms, so I'm not following your logic, OP. -3X
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swollenscott private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabemuscular
@musclesbrah24 Have you tried "bending the bar" when you bench?

Or when you do pushup, try to push your hands together into the floor, if you get what I'm saying.


Lighten the load and do a couple of feel sets with this technique. Worked for me. That and pre-fatiguing with flyes.
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Beans private msg quote post Address this user
@musclesbrah24 Are you asking a question?

Why don't you just do a press and a fly in your chest workouts? I do flat bench press and flat flys for my chest. You don't really have to do either/or. I can't really imagine just doing flys and still growing, as @eknight said, you just can't handle a significant amount of weight.
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Cannonball private msg quote post Address this user
Ofc there is such a thing as upper/lower chest. That you probably can't train them individually to an extent that matters is another thing.

Bending the bar is a benching technique where you attempt to bend the bar (as if you were trying to form it as a horseshoe) in order to automatically position your elbows and activate your triceps in a certain matter.

Some bodybuilders like to try and press the bar together to engage the chest more in correlation to the triceps. Dunno if or how it works, but I know the opposite works; pulling the bar apart in order to activate triceps more.

OP: can you show us a vid where you bench?
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musclesbrah24 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
While the contraction may not be as good as with a press, you'll never be able to handle enough weight with a fly vs a press. When you're bench pressing you ARE adducting the arms, so I'm not following your logic, OP. -3X


That extra weight on bench press is because your triceps and shoulders are taking the weight. It's not like all that extra weight is directed towards your chest. On presses you can't really go "in" towards the midline of your body.
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musclesbrah24 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannonball
Ofc there is such a thing as upper/lower chest. That you probably can't train them individually to an extent that matters is another thing.


This has been discussed many times in the fitness community. There isn't an upper/lower chest. There is only one insertion point.
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SwoleAnimal private msg quote post Address this user
yea just bench and fly mane. Go heavy on bench ..and then lighter weight but really feel the contraction when you do flys. You don't need much weight on flys; however, it is just the icing on the cake after you have already went heavy on pressing movements, be that dumbbell or barbell
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Cannonball private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by musclesbrah24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannonball
Ofc there is such a thing as upper/lower chest. That you probably can't train them individually to an extent that matters is another thing.


This has been discussed many times in the fitness community. There isn't an upper/lower chest. There is only one insertion point.


I'm glad you're able to respew what others have told you.




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Beans private msg quote post Address this user
@Cannonball That picture is the only one I've ever seen that shows the minor above the major, not under it. Am I missing something? Anyone?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
That's not the minor- it's the clavicular and sternal portions of pec major. -3X
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Beans private msg quote post Address this user
I though it looked backwards...

Haha thanks.
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musclesbrah24 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannonball
Quote:
Originally Posted by musclesbrah24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannonball
Ofc there is such a thing as upper/lower chest. That you probably can't train them individually to an extent that matters is another thing.


This has been discussed many times in the fitness community. There isn't an upper/lower chest. There is only one insertion point.


I'm glad you're able to respew what others have told you.






You can't isolate the heads so whats the point?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
This is true. -3X
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swollenscott private msg quote post Address this user
You can't isolate but you can shift the focus or feel. Physics would surely mean that an incline bench does recruit more clavicular head fibres of the pec due to the somewhat vertical nature/ shoulder flexion tension added rather than just horizontal adduction.
This has been backed with EMG studies...
clickable texts

...HOWEVER it is only an extra 5% so is it really worth it? Who knows. Horses for courses I guess. I generally stick to flat and go heavier rather than lighten up and go incline. Just my 4 cents
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ambitiongainer private msg quote post Address this user
@musclesbrah24 if you know so much why you be coming on here for advice

take your own advice and do what you gotta do but if i recall you said you been working on your chest for 3 years and no major improvement

so either you take these guys smart advices or do what you gotta do and see where that takes you *goodluck* *thumbs up*
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
@swollenscott that study had been disputed. Every other EMG study I'm aware of shows that the focus can not be shifted by manipulating the angle. -3X
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swollenscott private msg quote post Address this user
Didn't know that. I'll do some looking into it. Cheers @eknight

Routine suggestion: do what Dwayne Johnson did for Hercules. Worked for him right?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
Copy and pasted from my previous thread on the topic:

We've all heard for years, I'm sure, that doing incline bench presses will work more of the upper chest, right? Wrong. Here's why. Quick review of anatomy for those who are interested. The muscles of the chest are composed of two primary muscles- the pec major and minor. The pec minor is NOT a "mover." It is a fixating muscle whose only action is fixate and stabilize the scapula by drawing it inferiorly and anteriorly against the thoracic wall. In other words, it will not gain significant hypertrophy from bench pressing, because that's just not what it does- it fixates and helps keeps the shoulder joint in place; it doesn't move and contract the way that the pec major does. Next, the pec major- the large muscle that fans our from the sternum to the shoulder joint, with fibers running out in that direction. Muscles, as we all know, can only contract in the following ways- one, either completely or not at all (like a light switch), so there's no way to work only a portion of the muscle; in other words, you can't cause a nerve impulse to contract from one portion of the muscle without contracting the entire thing- just doesn't work that way. Two, they only contract in the direction that the fibers run (which is why pullovers are not a "chest" movement- they cause the chest to move up-and-down, not in and out). Finally, Electromyography (EMG) is a technique for evaluating and recording the electrical activity produced by skeletal muscles. It actually measures where and how hard a muscle contracts. Basically, when a muscle contracts it produces electrical energy. The higher the electrical energy the more work the actual muscle is producing. By attaching electrodes to the skin over the bellies of each of these muscles this electrical energy can be measured and read using an electromyograph (EMG).
OK, now that that's out of the way, some logic should dictate my next point- if you can only contract a muscle entiely or not at all, significant changes in how that muscle contracts shouldn't be caused by changing the angle of a pressing movement. This is why inclines do not cause significant growth in the "upper pecs"- first, there are no upper pecs, just pecs; second, moving the angle will not increase greater contraction across this gradient.
When applying EMG activity to the chest, what do the results say? Rather than citing each of the several studies that say this, I'll direct you to the follwoing meta-analysis, which has done just that, and quote some of the particulars. Have a read of the entire thing if it interests you: http://www.thesportjournal.org/article/optimizing-development-pectoralis-major

The first noteworthy piece here, states, "It has been perceived that by performing the bench press at the incline position the clavicular head is targeted while the horizontal position targets the sternocostal head. Barnett, C., et al. (1995) showed that the clavicular head showed no significant difference in EMG activity from the horizontal to the incline position but was least active during the decline bench press. "

Barnett, C., et al (1995), also found this to be true, noting "The incline press does not result in greater activation of the clavicular head of the pectoralis major than the horizontal bench press." (http://www.daveywaveyfitness.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/Effects-of-Variations-of-the-Bench-Press-Exercise-on-the-EMG-Activity-of-Five-Shoulder-Muscles.pdf)

Glass, S. C., & Armstrong, T. also found this to be true, concluding that, "there was no significant difference in activation of the upper pectoral portion during either the incline or decline bench press."

In fact, EVERY EMG test I know of said the same thing- isolation of the upper pecs, or even noticeably greater development of them is not going to happen from doing inclines. -3X
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swollenscott private msg quote post Address this user
Cheers @eknight

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