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How does my new lifting/diet plan look?19123

forgottenpass private msg quote post Address this user
Hey, what's up guys!

Had to take some time off the gym due to school, work etc. But I will be going back this week. During the time off I lost almost all my strength and muscle mass. I will be cutting almost 30lbs and trying to get back my strength.
I am 6ft 1, 200 lbs. 25% body fat.


For dieting my calories/macros look like this:
2,000
175g Carbs
200g Protein
56g Fats
I am trying to get rid of this fat as fast as possible while maintaining all my muscle mass or building new muscle.

For training I wanted to do a fullbody 4X a week. I made a split and wanted your opinions on it. Is this too much volume or is it fine as long as I am recovering each workout. I wanted to make sure I have optimal volume in order to try to build muscle on this cut.


-Thanks!

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moke912 private msg quote post Address this user
1.you will overtrain your arms
2.you can't build muscle while you're losing fat , unless you're using some ...
3.no need to hit your whole body 4 times per week

I think you shouldn't build your routine alone you're not in this level yet . follow one of the rouitnes listed in this forum . or let some trainer make routine for you (i'm personal trainer and nutritionist by the way)
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
^^ he's pretty much spot-on. -3X
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Aoverto7 private msg quote post Address this user
I would split it up in an upper/lower fashion. You have way too much going on for each workout. As previous posters said, check out some routine templates that have already been designed.

Also, do you know what your current maintenance calories are? Starting at 2000 k/cals seems really low for somebody your size which would lead me to believe that you are going to stall out on your weight loss rather quickly because you don't have many calories to cut from in the first place. Your calories are going to get extremely low or you will be doing insane amounts of cardio. Neither of which are sustainable. I know you want to drop the weight quickly, but it may be beneficial to work at a slow methodical rate on the most amount of calories while still losing weight. Once you do stall out, maybe look in to reverse dieting to increase your caloric load.

Good luck!
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forgottenpass private msg quote post Address this user
@moke912
1. How will I overtrain my arms if im only doing 12 sets per week? Which is in the lower end of the recommended sets per week.

2. Who told you you can't build muscle on a deficit?..Of course you can, especially if your a novice, overweight and your lifts are weak.

3. Since i will be starting with each lift very light, I can afford to lift 4x because i wont run into stalling or fatigue from super heavy weight.

Plus this is just the routine icf 5x5 with 2-3 more exercises pullups, dips.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
Being a beginner- as in maybe 6 months or so- you can build muscle in a calorie deficit. Being a novice, obese, and weak are not conditions that also make that possible. How do you suppose you're going to accomplish this? Through what mechanism of biochemistry do you expect your body will accomplish increasing tissue size without the fuel to do so? -3X
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forgottenpass private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aoverto7
I would split it up in an upper/lower fashion. You have way too much going on for each workout. As previous posters said, check out some routine templates that have already been designed.

Also, do you know what your current maintenance calories are? Starting at 2000 k/cals seems really low for somebody your size which would lead me to believe that you are going to stall out on your weight loss rather quickly because you don't have many calories to cut from in the first place. Your calories are going to get extremely low or you will be doing insane amounts of cardio. Neither of which are sustainable. I know you want to drop the weight quickly, but it may be beneficial to work at a slow methodical rate on the most amount of calories while still losing weight. Once you do stall out, maybe look in to reverse dieting to increase your caloric load.

Good luck!


Good point man.

I started this way because like I said in the post above I will be starting each lift super light, working on form. Thus I don't have to worry about stalling for a while.
I was thinking about starting at 2,000 then bumping it up 200 calories every couple weeks, so at the same time my lifts are getting heavier.

Also how does weight stall when in a constant deficit?
For example, if I eat 1,500 calories, my body will burn fat plus some muscle and just keep burning it till I reaches a much lower weight and a new tdee, which the high deficit will no longer be.
...lol if you get what i'm trying to say?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
No, that's not accurate. Especially with extreme deficits, your body adapts to the lower calories through a process called adaptive thermogenesis or metabolic downregulation. At that point, a calorie debt greater than mathematically predicted is needed to confirm weight loss. -3X
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forgottenpass private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Being a beginner- as in maybe 6 months or so- you can build muscle in a calorie deficit. Being a novice, obese, and weak are not conditions that also make that possible. How do you suppose you're going to accomplish this? Through what mechanism of biochemistry do you expect your body will accomplish increasing tissue size without the fuel to do so? -3X


When someone is at such a high body fat level 25%+ they are able to use the excess fat as energy, thus not needing a surplus. Plus being very weak means the individual has very low muscle mass, making recomping alot easier. That's why someone who is strong and have a low bodyfat has a hard time losing fat and building muscle(most likely intermediates or advanced) but an individuals who is overweight and weak can build muscle while losing fat.

I came to this conclusions based on many people who say its possible, plus there have been many studies done by people like lyle McDonald who have data on people building muscle while losing weight
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forgottenpass private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
No, that's not accurate. Especially with extreme deficits, your body adapts to the lower calories through a process called adaptive thermogenesis or metabolic downregulation. At that point, a calorie debt greater than mathematically predicted is needed to confirm weight loss. -3X


So your saying creating a large unhealthy deficit makes it harder for the body to lose fat? Because the body is trying to hold on to the fat, due to a such restricted intake?
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Aoverto7 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by forgottenpass
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
No, that's not accurate. Especially with extreme deficits, your body adapts to the lower calories through a process called adaptive thermogenesis or metabolic downregulation. At that point, a calorie debt greater than mathematically predicted is needed to confirm weight loss. -3X


So your saying creating a large unhealthy deficit makes it harder for the body to lose fat? Because the body is trying to hold on to the fat, due to a such restricted intake?


Correct, the body believes it is in starvation mode and begins reducing metabolic functioning in order to survive. This can create metabolic damage if done for a long period of time.

I have seen some recent studies where extremely obese people use a larger deficit to being with, and they have had great success, but I do not believe you fall in to that category.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
Noteworthy, too, is that the reason recomping is possible for beginners is because the body creates new myonuclei that remain long after muscle mass decreases. Being weak and overweight has zero to do with it.

Even at a high body fat, your body requires a positive nitrogen balance to build muscle. Nitrogen is found in protein, not in carbs or dietary fat. And certainly not in stored body fat. It's all carbons, hydrogens, and oxygens. No nitrogen. So no muscle growth if your kcal deficit is that great. -3X
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Dorich private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Noteworthy, too, is that the reason recomping is possible for beginners is because the body creates new myonuclei that remain long after muscle mass decreases. Being weak and overweight has zero to do with it.

This is insightful. I always thought that it's the huge amount of excess fat that has something to do with it, the body using it as a "surplus" to build muscle like it does with excess kcal.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
See my above comment re. nitrogen balance. Hopefully, it seems logical to you that even if you eat a massive surplus and train hard, you won't get optimal hypertrophy without enough protein. -3X
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Dorich private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
See my above comment re. nitrogen balance. Hopefully, it seems logical to you that even if you eat a massive surplus and train hard, you won't get optimal hypertrophy without enough protein. -3X

Yeah, makes sense.
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BeStrong private msg quote post Address this user
Dont drop calories too low, because it could lead to stalling pretty quickly I think.
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