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My P/P/L Program (proposed)Comments please?16471

qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
So I have been doodling at work and rewriting my PPL program based on what I have learned here and talking to as many trainers as possible. All I done to the original PPL program is removed some optional exercises and replaced with exercises that I actually enjoy(I put a comment whenever I do this).

A bit about me? I am 24, part viet mostly aussie and my work is in a 24/7 gym. My goal is to be in the best shape possible (just finished a cutting phase) for my trip next year. The things that matter the most to me in life overall are my family, my friends and my health, I feel that without these things life does not have much purpose. I have a background in gymnastics and long jump from when I was little.

Ok without further ado here is my version of PPL

Push (Chest/Triceps/Shoulders):

Flat Barbell Bench Press: 3x5
Standing Barbell Overhead Press: 3x5
Dumbbell Side Lateral Raise: 3x10-12
Dips: 3x10-12 *I added these because I like them and I am good at them
Overhead Dumbbell Extension: 3x10-12

Pull (Back/Biceps):

Romanian Deadlift: 3x5 *I will deadlift once a week only
Barbell Rows: 3x5
Assisted Chin-Ups: 3x8-10
Incline DB Curls: 4x-10-12
Face-pulls: 3x-10-12

Legs (Quad/Ham/Calves):

Barbell Squats: 4x5-6
Lunges: 3x8-10 *instead of leg press I want a unilateral leg exercise
Hamstring Curls: 3x10-12
Ab Wheel: 3x12
Hanging Leg Raises: Leg Raises 3x12 *I added this because I want to work on my abs more. I took out calf raises because my calfs dont respond to this.. but they like (grow) with spin class, volleyball, combat.

I like to do P/P/L/P/P/L/rest per week. That would work out simple because I can train during lunch hour then get straight back to work. So I like to keep everything under 1hr if poss. Also I have tried to keep push pull 1:2.

I would appreciate if you can give me feedback and comment based on your expereicne to help me make this my best program ever! Ta

My stats if interested.


18.5% BF (Caliper) 65.5KG height 167cm.
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Rawsteel private msg quote post Address this user
Why are you working hams on pull and then again on legs (2 days in a row)?
Do RDL and leg curls on your leg workout, you might also want to throw in another 2 light sets of ham curl, like 2x15.
If i remember right Eknight wrote something about knee flexion/knee extension ratio being much more important for women (correct me if i'm wrong eknight).
And why 3x5 OHP when you do 3x5 bench? Your anterior delts get hit hard in bench, so doing both heavy bench and heavy ohp on the same workout feels pretty unnecessary, personally i would have upped it to 3x8.
I would also have upped the volume a little bit more on the pull days.

Also, going that heavy (3x5) 6 days a week will most likely catch upp with you eventually, to fix this you could do A/B workouts, one ligh with shorter rest between sets and one heavy with longer rest between sets in the main exercises.

PS, looking VERY good
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A_em private msg quote post Address this user
Hey,
Congrats on your cut!
I must say those pics are on a bad quality (widen?) or you bf is false. I look a bit similar, with visible abs and my bf after scanning is almost 30 %. Don't want to be suspicious, but had to say it. I won't comment the lack of tatoos on your profile pic
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nine0seven private msg quote post Address this user
Proposed? Yeah I'll propose to you (srs)
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THE GODFATHER wannabemuscular private msg quote post Address this user
@qtdreams92 Reps for tattoos and cute butt.
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3six9 private msg quote post Address this user
@qtdreams92 When was your avi taken?
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THE GODFATHER wannabemuscular private msg quote post Address this user
I think you just can't see the tattoos in the avi because they're covered mostly by the high cut pants.
Post 7 IP   flag post
A_em private msg quote post Address this user
Aha, and two days ago she posted a pic of her back with the current date, no tatts, super short pony tail, but the hell! Maybe I am just too perceptive.

You go girl!
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3six9 private msg quote post Address this user
@qtdreams92 Where did you get the programme from?
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3six9 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksandra_em
Hey,
Congrats on your cut!
I must say those pics are on a bad quality (widen?) or you bf is false. I look a bit similar, with visible abs and my bf after scanning is almost 30 %. Don't want to be suspicious, but had to say it. I won't comment the lack of tatoos on your profile pic


MEOWW LOL.
Post 10 IP   flag post
bicepKing private msg quote post Address this user
Correct me if I'm wrong, but females have a different muscular structure and hormonal base to males and this would mean their response to certain training methods would be different to males. For example simulating hypertrophy in males could usually involve a rep range of 8-12 but in females it would be different.

Therefore shouldn't a females routine be fairly different to a males?

Also, Half Viet Crew checking in. GOAT genetics ;-)
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TimmothyGen private msg quote post Address this user
I'm pretty sure women can train just as hard as guys.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
@bicepKing just... No. -3X
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qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
@Rawsteel Thanks for the feed back! I didn't put the RDL in legs because I will be squatting also that day. I think it may be too much for me? And what you suggest about hamcurls is 6 sets in total.. Ok I can deal with that if it will help me. No leg extensions because @eknight said so
As for the OHP I wrote down now to work up to 3x8. My bench press and OHP is not heavy at all. they are my least favourite exercise for a reason.

I think the A/B option is a good idea. I want to spend the next week to find out my starting weight. Should I get my trainer to help me for the 1 rep max for everything and then use 85% as starting weight on heavy days A and 50% on light days B?

@Aleksandra_em haha thanks for your comments! I am interested in dexa scan which will give me more legit result than just calliper. Well I def hope it is not 30% lol. The attention to the detail in your comment, wow. The previous picture was for our member newsletter and they used a concealer. its called tatto camo. I was so dehydrated on that day so I don't like it and I took it down. My hair was in a half knot pony. anyway never mind
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qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
@3six9 Hi it is based on Coolcicada's Push/Pull/Legs Routine. (still skimming through the posts in that big thread!). The avi was my before photo from a few months ago. so I'll make a new one.

edit. done, thanks to quick toilet trip
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qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
@bicepKing Thanks! and cheers for the advice. Well when I started training I was fighting with the PT over starting strength program because it was so not what I had in mind. Barbells, presses, dead lifts? I am glad I stuck with it because it has changed my view on lifting completely. The article called 'womens training guide' made lots of sense too.
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A_em private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3six9
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleksandra_em
Hey,
Congrats on your cut!
I must say those pics are on a bad quality (widen?) or you bf is false. I look a bit similar, with visible abs and my bf after scanning is almost 30 %. Don't want to be suspicious, but had to say it. I won't comment the lack of tatoos on your profile pic


MEOWW LOL.


Yawn



Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92


@Aleksandra_em haha thanks for your comments! I am interested in dexa scan which will give me more legit result than just calliper. Well I def hope it is not 30% lol.


Yeah, just judging by the pics, I suggested that maybe the quality is low. But my measurments are lower, too. So go get a scan, hope you won;t be dissapointed
Or maybe hey- I am under 20 %bf, too! (smirk)

Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
The attention to the detail in your comment, wow.

Yeah.. just me

Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
The previous picture was for our member newsletter and they used a concealer. its called tatto camo. I was so dehydrated on that day so I don't like it and I took it down. My hair was in a half knot pony. anyway never mind

I will leave it without comment heh

Good luck on your routine
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bicepKing private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
@bicepKing Thanks! and cheers for the advice. Well when I started training I was fighting with the PT over starting strength program because it was so not what I had in mind. Barbells, presses, dead lifts? I am glad I stuck with it because it has changed my view on lifting completely. The article called 'womens training guide' made lots of sense too.


Glad it is working out for you. Keep it up!
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Rawsteel private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
@Rawsteel Thanks for the feed back! I didn't put the RDL in legs because I will be squatting also that day. I think it may be too much for me?


Definitely not, if it would have been normal deadlifts then it might have been a bit to tough, but RDL's are not as hard on the CNS.
Lunges are however pretty demanding and takes the breath out of most people, so if you feel to fatiqued when you have added RDL to this workout change lunges to some other unilateral exercise that isn't as demanding, like one legged leg press.
I also suggest that you do your first 3 sets of leg curl unilateral, just to avoid imbalances.
Then you have 1 bilateral exercise and 1 unilateral for both quads and hams.
Back when i could squat, rdl etc i ran it like this and i loved it.

Squat: 3x5/8 (alternated each workout) + back off set 1x8/10 (-20% weight)
Unilateral leg press: 3x10
RDL: 3x5/8 + back off set 1x8/10 (-20% weight)
Seated unilateral leg curl: 3x10
+ Calves and abs

Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
And what you suggest about hamcurls is 6 sets in total.. Ok I can deal with that if it will help me. No leg extensions because @eknight said so


Yea, it would be RDL 3x5 + Leg curl 3x8-10 + 2 ligh high rep sets, like 2x15, just to play it safe.
Here's a thread were Eknigh talks about flexion/extension ratio.
And here's a quote from him in another thread regarding women and ham training ->

"It's less about the exercises you choose and more about the volume- especially for females, who tend to be more quad dominant in particular. In general, due to higher susceptibility of ACL injury, females need to do 20-30% greater volume for hams than quads. As noted above, leg curls and glute-ham raises are better than deads or good mornings, but all of these can be useful. -3X

http://forum.simplyshredded.com/topic/16075/favorite-hamstring-exercises/"


Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
I think the A/B option is a good idea. I want to spend the next week to find out my starting weight. Should I get my trainer to help me for the 1 rep max for everything and then use 85% as starting weight on heavy days A and 50% on light days B?


You don't need to test your 1RM, you can use this to see what your 1RM probably is.
And 50% sounds a bit to light, what i like to do is alternate 3x5 with 3 min rest between sets and 3x8 with 2 min rest between sets, that should be around 80-85% and 70-75% for most people.
You can go lighter if you want though, like 3x10.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
^^great info there.

Additionally, single leg deads are awesome movements because they also increase pelvic stability by activating the glute med more and they're a CKC movement, which is always a 👍 -3X
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qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
@Rawsteel Thank you for writing that out. I am scribbling away with changes and notes and its taken all over my file! I feel like a mad treasure hunter, coming into work early to do this.

Right now I am unsure about 'progression'. Like I know I can squat 45kg x 5 reps safely. would you recommend my starting weight be 50kg day A and 45 on day B then add 2.5kg every week? Or keep the 45kg and try to reach 6, 7 reps before I add 2.5kg as my 'progression'.

For machine exercises, say the rep range is 3 x of 8-10 reps.
If I do leg curls
Set 1: 3plates x 10 reps
Set 2: 3plates x 9 reps
Set 3: 3plates x 8 reps
Do I keep trying each session until I get 3 x 10 reps or do I 'progress' to 4plates because each set is within 8-10 range?

The calculator must think I am wonderwoman lol. 60kg romanian DL is my 1rm? Lol I have never lifted this

@eknight shame hamstsring curl is a open kinchain movement.
Single leg deads would be awesome to master. like the pistol squat I saw yesterday afternoon.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
@qtdreams92 Ham curls are OCK, but Nordics, Glute-ham raises and modified glute-hams aren't. 👍 -3X
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qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
Yea! taking all this on board, so far I will make the changes like:

- take out the romanian DL for now (or do conventional DL) because it takes way too long to warm up and my sessions need to be < 1hr.
- add extra sets of leg curls 3x10 and add 2 unilateral sets 2x15
- volleyball, jogging, and combat is working my calves nicely as is
- OHP start with 3x5 working up to 3x8 OR replace OHP with cable flyes (trainer suggestion)
- replace face pulls with reverse flyes (trainer suggestion)
- we dont have a glute ham raise machine but I've ask the manager and request if we can get one!

Please tell me I understood it all correct

Also if I can have some advice about progression (my post above) I am excited to start this program!
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
Id drop deadlift from pull day. Add a hip extension/flexion movement into leg day, and also a calf exercise maybe? Then personally put another row into pull day
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Rawsteel private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
@Rawsteel Thank you for writing that out. I am scribbling away with changes and notes and its taken all over my file! I feel like a mad treasure hunter, coming into work early to do this.

Right now I am unsure about 'progression'. Like I know I can squat 45kg x 5 reps safely. would you recommend my starting weight be 50kg day A and 45 on day B then add 2.5kg every week? Or keep the 45kg and try to reach 6, 7 reps before I add 2.5kg as my 'progression'.


Personally i like to keep it simple and increase the weight with the smallest amount possible (2x0.5 kg plates) when i can hit 5/8 reps in all 3 sets with good form and being 1 rep shy of failure in the last set.
The last rep is with other words hard to complete but it is completed (with good form).
When i didn't have 0.5 kg plates i had to use the lighest plates they had at the gym and they were at 1.25 kg, so back then i increased the weight set by set (still do sometimes) because a 2.5 kg increase in all 3 sets would be to much, it resulted in me coming to close to failure in the second set and dropping to much in the reps in the third.
It could look like this ->

Workout 1
100 kg x 5, 5, 5, managed to hit my reps with good form and the last rep 1 from failure.

Workout 2
102.5 kg x 5
100 kg x 5, 4, did not hit rep goal so keeping.

Workout 3
102.5 kg x 5
100 kg x 5, 5, hit it, so increasing second set.

Workout 4
102.5 kg x 5, 5
100 kg x 4, when 5 could be done here i would use 102.5 in all 3 sets.

In some exercises i didn't increase the weight untill i could do 5/5/6 or 8/8/9.
How you do it is up to you, the important thing is that you manage to progressively overload.

Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
For machine exercises, say the rep range is 3 x of 8-10 reps.
If I do leg curls
Set 1: 3plates x 10 reps
Set 2: 3plates x 9 reps
Set 3: 3plates x 8 reps
Do I keep trying each session until I get 3 x 10 reps or do I 'progress' to 4plates because each set is within 8-10 range?


If i were you i would just keep it simple and use straight sets and the same progression method as in your main exercises, like 3x10 or 3x8.

Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
Yea! taking all this on board, so far I will make the changes like:

- take out the romanian DL for now (or do conventional DL) because it takes way too long to warm up and my sessions need to be < 1hr.
- add extra sets of leg curls 3x10 and add 2 unilateral sets 2x15
- volleyball, jogging, and combat is working my calves nicely as is
- OHP start with 3x5 working up to 3x8 OR replace OHP with cable flyes (trainer suggestion)
- replace face pulls with reverse flyes (trainer suggestion)
- we dont have a glute ham raise machine but I've ask the manager and request if we can get one!


1. Do you mean you're going to skip them completely because it takes to long doing them on leg day, or?
2. Correct.
4. I suggest you keep them and do them as 3x8. Here's an exmaple of how your push workout could look like.
But if you really like dips keep it as it is, personally i hate them, ruined my shoulders (and many others).

Flat Barbell Bench Press: 3x5/8
Standing Barbell Overhead Press: 3x8
Cable flyes: 3x10
Dumbbell Side Lateral Raise: 3x10
Overhead Dumbbell Extension: 3x8
Pushdowns: 2x12

5. Sounds good.
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qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rawsteel
1. Do you mean you're going to skip them completely because it takes to long doing them on leg day, or?
2. Correct.
4. I suggest you keep them and do them as 3x8. Here's an exmaple of how your push workout could look like.
But if you really like dips keep it as it is, personally i hate them, ruined my shoulders (and many others).

Flat Barbell Bench Press: 3x5/8
Standing Barbell Overhead Press: 3x8
Cable flyes: 3x10
Dumbbell Side Lateral Raise: 3x10
Overhead Dumbbell Extension: 3x8
Pushdowns: 2x12

5. Sounds good.

1. Yea because of all the warm ups and rest time with deadlifts and squats on the same day I won't be able to do everything in one hours.
4. I like doing 3x8 with the OHP anyway so I think I will stick with that on this program too thanks!
I used to do dips as warm up drill before floor work in gymnastics so I hope to still be able to do them.

And just to get it clearer, if I choose a weight I can do 3x8 without failure, should I then use 85% of that for my 1st week in the program? Because if I start with 3x8max then I am scared that I will stall too soon? We have 0.25kg but not 0.125kg plates so the jump is pretty high from week 1 to week 2 and so on.
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qtdreams92 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hamer93
Id drop deadlift from pull day. Add a hip extension/flexion movement into leg day, and also a calf exercise maybe? Then personally put another row into pull day

Thank you, so for hip extenion would you recommend box jumps and kettle bell swings to be suitable? This will double nicely as warm up so I can save time.
And I like ideas on 'other row'. Do you mean seated cable or like lying ring pullups?
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
I ment a movement to hit the hamstrings and glutes, maybe bridges, hamstring bridges, good mornings etc and for the row maybe low cable row?
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Rawsteel private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92

1. Yea because of all the warm ups and rest time with deadlifts and squats on the same day I won't be able to do everything in one hours.


Then you can do it like this if you want to deadlift ->

1. Pull (+DL)/Push/Legs, this way your legs/low back atleast gets 1 days rest between the leg and pull workout.

2. Put both RDL or normal DL's + leg curls on the pull workout and just work the front of your legs + calves on your leg day.

3. Do squats, rdl, lunges or some other unilateral exercise, leg curls and calves on leg day and move your ab training to your pull day, running it as in alternative 1 (pull/push/legs).

Personally i would have gone with 3.

Quote:
Originally Posted by qtdreams92
And just to get it clearer, if I choose a weight I can do 3x8 without failure, should I then use 85% of that for my 1st week in the program? Because if I start with 3x8max then I am scared that I will stall too soon? We have 0.25kg but not 0.125kg plates so the jump is pretty high from week 1 to week 2 and so on.


As said, i like to keep it simple and just use a weight that allows me to hit 5/8 reps in the first 2 sets and then increase it when i can do 5/8 or 6/9 in the third set (1 rep from fail).
What percentage it is i do not know.

0.25kg plates? Didn't even know that existed, though 0.5kg was the lowest.
Then the increase shouldn't be to high, and if it is, simply increase set by set.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
LMAO, OP is never going to work out because she will always be awaiting clarification on her program.

QT- you're grossly overthinking. Keep it simple. Do twice as much pull as push. Give you hams a bit more work than your quads (in other words, a little more hip extension and knee flexion with wieghts than knee extension), and have fun. Exercise choices don't really matter much. Go work out. -3X
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