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scientific evidence VS results15792

ambitiongainer private msg quote post Address this user
so THIS IS IT, we know this is a MAJOR topic right and especially since a lot of person here thinks what EMG says about incline chest being in effective to targeting upper chest specifically

but what I want to know if incline chest doesn't hit your upper chest specifically, why do people just came out of no where and decide to create incline bench press and came with the theory of incline bench being able to target upper chest specifically

In fact why all the well know bodybuilder even do incline bench if it doesn't work?

and why when I don't do incline bench for awhile I see my upper chest starting to lag?

why other personal trainers and famous BB always recommend people to do incline bench for upper chest?

personally I don't think that science can prove everything, for example Tricep is 3 muscles, but in order to work all those 3 muscle you have to hit them in different angles, so since all those 3 muscles cant work without each other, why do we even do them in different angles because if you work one tricep muscle all tricep muscles are working, its just that your putting more emphasize on one specific tricep muscle that's what I think

but I would love to hear other opinions on this matter and also explain to me why people do incline chest and why they also recommend it.....
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kickinchicken private msg quote post Address this user
The tricep isn't one muscle. Pecs are. Do whatever you want and stop beating a dead horse.
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_RudeCrew private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by kickinchicken
The tricep isn't one muscle. Pecs are. Do whatever you want and stop beating a dead horse.
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_RudeCrew private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambitiongainer


but what I want to know if incline chest doesn't hit your upper chest specifically, why do people just came out of no where and decide to create incline bench press and came with the theory of incline bench being able to target upper chest specifically



For the same reason companies throw random ingredients into a bottle and tell you that you will put 50lbs on your bicep curls. Marketing.
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NorIda private msg quote post Address this user
Because no matter how hard we try, we can't fix stupid.


Trust me. I deal with stupid every day.
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Trev182 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorIda
Because no matter how hard we try, we can't fix stupid.


Trust me. I deal with stupid every day.
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shannowman private msg quote post Address this user
Swayze, is that you?
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
pec arnt one muscle, there are 3 muscle of the pec but they are all work at same time no metter if u do incline decline or flat.
the tricep is not different there are three muscle Long head, Lateral head, Medial head, but they are all work for extension the elbow.
everytime u bench press they work everytime u just elbow extension they are all work .
except that when u move your shoulder joint to extension u use more long head of tricept .
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nine0seven private msg quote post Address this user
I'm not gonna lie and I hope I don't get anyone butt hurt..

Im Not a huge fan of "science."

Do whatever routine you ENJOY because that's the routine you will give 100% of your effort and will see more results than running a routine you don't enjoy.

Just my opinion
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
@ambitiongainer there is so much wrong with your original post, I have no idea where to begin. It's clear that you don't have a solid grasp of muscle action, origin and insertion of you would not have made several of the statements that you did. I don't know what else to tell you. There are still people who believe the world is flat as well. Why?

@golago the pec major is not three muscles, it is one muscle. You may be thinking of the pec minor, which is a separate muscle but does not have the same action as the major; it functions as a scapular stabilizer. Likewise the triceps are one muscle. The only difference in how the triceps are activated is in shoulder position because the long head originates on the scapula, not the humerus, so it functions as a shoulder extensor as well as elbow extensor. Other then moving your shoulder into flexion to do triceps extensions, no other variation hits one head any more or less. -3X
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight

this what i have learned in anatomy.
the primary muscle is the pectoralis major he is divide to three muscle the midle lower and upper they are all work while bench pressing no metter what angle ,
the lower work as synergist when u are extension the shoulder joint.
the upper is synergist when flexion the shoulder joint ,
they are all working when u are adduction the shoulder joint .

about the tricep it is one muscle from what i have learned and know with 3 head.
middle lateral and long head
the long head of the tricept attach to the Infraglenoid tubercle of scapula this is why he is the only who work in shoulder extension.
all the muscle of the tricept work in extension of the elbow .

i will ask me Lecturer about that for being sure .
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight

i meant to say three head not three muscle if it does make sens
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
@golago the pec major is not divided into three muscles. It's one single muscle. I can't possible believe any anatomy book on this planet would say it's three muscles. You've misread something. My guess is that your book stated something like, "There are three muscles that lie in the pectoral region and exert a force on the upper limb. They are the pectoralis major, pectoralis minor, and the serratus anterior." -3X
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight
no it say three head the midle lower and upper
as i said it is head not muscle.
the lower head synergist wheil extension the shoulder and the upper wheil flexion synergist.
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
That's not correct either though. The pec major has two heads, as differentiated by insertion, origin, and innervation. The two- and ONLY two heads- are the sternal and clavicular. -3X
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight
Upper Pectoralis
(Clavicular head)
Middle Pectoralis
(Sternal head)
Lower Pectoralis
(Costal head)
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
The sternal and costal heads are not separate. They are one head (the sternocostal head, often referred to simply as the sternal head), that originates on the anterior surface of the sternum, the superior six costal cartilages, and the aponeurosis of the external oblique muscle, and inserts on the humerus. No literature in the clinical community separates it further. Have a read: http://www.rad.washington.edu/academics/academic-sections/msk/muscle-atlas/upper-body/pectoralis-major

-3X
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ambitiongainer private msg quote post Address this user
remember everyone I'm trying to understand fully why ppl think incline bench work that much and why my upper chest starts to lag when I don't do incline bench

I'm not saying y'all cant be right, we are having a conversation to gain more knowledge, don't expect people to get emotional now

like I was wondering maybe like the upper part of chest is getting more emphasize than the middle or lower, like the entire chest is working but the upper part are being more pressured or something and no I'm not knowledgeable as much as you guys when it comes to how the muscle works but I would like to learn so that's why I make this post

not to try start an argument or hit someone nerve....

so basically everyone is saying neither decline or incline makes no sense to be doing it?
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ambitiongainer private msg quote post Address this user
and I'm learning alot so far though... never too young to learn
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
@ambitiongainer a good portion of what you're asking has been covered here: http://forum.simplyshredded.com/topic/1881/page/1/bench-press-and-upper-pecs/

@golago from this anatomy textbook (this was the closest one I had on hand, all of them say the same thing):



Note the following pages. Upper and lower; no middle:




-3X
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight

ok thank !
i am learning in university not a book.

i will be greatfull if u will explain me something.
as i know from what i have learned the clavicular head get worked as synergist wheil shoulder flexion and the sternal head wheil extension right?
this is how the Lecturer explained it
i know it will not make the clavicular head look bigger so how can u explain this ?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
I'm not sure I'm following your question exactly. Can you rephrase? -3X
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight

does it truth that when i extension the shoulder the sternal head work as synergist and when i flexion the shoulder the clavicular head work as synergist right ?

so if i will do only shoulder flexion (the one and the only exersicse i will do for the next 1 year ,
does my clavicular head will get bigger and the rest of my chest will stay the same ?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
Unlikely. I don't believe the amount of assistance it provides in either flexion or extension is significant enough to make that sort of difference. Plus, there's no way NOT to do all of the movements that require pectoral action in your daily life (adduction and internal rotatation of the humerus). -3X
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golago private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight

thank!
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Beans private msg quote post Address this user
@ambitiongainer Did someone tell you NOT to do incline bench? There's nothing wrong with doing it. Why don't you just switch it into your routine and see if you notice a difference?
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ambitiongainer private msg quote post Address this user
@Beans what I've been getting from this is that incline bench doing make any great impact on upper chest because ek said there is no upper chest but what I'VE ALSO FINDING OUT FROM THIS TOPIC IS

no matter what you say this topic will always be debatable, so either an updated EMG or something scientifically proven that incline works upper chest more to let everyone finally come to an agreement

so far now everyone should agree to disagree with each other

for my conclusion I'm going with what my BODY TELLS ME, so when I do incline bench I feel like my upper chest is getting pump and also feel like its I'm proven

for all my chest day routine I always do 3 sets of flat, 3 sets of incline and 3 set of decline so even if incline and decline was scientifically proven that it wont work upper or lower chest more, I still will be doing them because my body feels like its getting a good workout from each exercises

so to answer your question I was always doing incline bench and also this topic from what I've seen in the thread that EK created too many people get heated from this topic saying it wont work upper chest and that it will work upper chest until it becomes an argument

I'm too mature for that shit so either people just listen to EK statements that he haS proven with his scientific facts and either follow it or do as hodgetwins usually say, "DO DHA FUCK YOU WANNA DO" simple Isn't it?
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the1 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by nine0seven
I'm not gonna lie and I hope I don't get anyone butt hurt..

Im Not a huge fan of "science."

Do whatever routine you ENJOY because that's the routine you will give 100% of your effort and will see more results than running a routine you don't enjoy.

Just my opinion
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambitiongainer
no matter what you say this topic will always be debatable, so either an updated EMG or something scientifically proven that incline works upper chest more to let everyone finally come to an agreement


No, it actually ISN'T debatable. The literature is pretty clear on that. At this point, debating it is like debating gravity or the speed of sound. You can choose to believe the world is still flat, and that's fine, but it doesn't mean that that is a debatable topic. Why in the world would an "updated" piece of research change what has been clinically established? And if it did, why would you suddenly believe a single study vs all of the other ones? Simply because it supports your view? If people practiced medicine this way, we would still be drilling holes in people's skulls to relieve migraines.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ambitiongainer
for my conclusion I'm going with what my BODY TELLS ME, so when I do incline bench I feel like my upper chest is getting pump


Then how do you explain the fact that my "upper chest" is full, rounded out and looks great? I've never done inclines. You understand that our bodies are all 99.9% exactly the same down to nearly the last strand of proteins? Your results on this and mine aren't going to be different. It doesn't work that way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ambitiongainer
I'm too mature for that shit


What a crock. Why even start this thread then? Very few people are going to watch an apple fall from a tree and debate gravity. -3X
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Beans private msg quote post Address this user
@ambitiongainer Just do incline then man. If your chest made better gains doing it, then do it. Regardless of whether or not it's working your "upper chest", if it's works, it works.
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