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Some questions about PHAT13526

Rawsteel private msg quote post Address this user
As the title says, i have never done PHAT and probably never will, but im curious, how the heck do you who run it manage to recover and how does your shoulders feel?

This is the basic split

Day 1: Upper Body Power
Day 2: Lower Body Power
Day 3: Rest
Day 4: Back and Shoulders Hypertrophy
Day 5: Lower Body Hypertrophy
Day 6: Chest and Arms Hypertrophy
Day 7: Rest

In total the front delts gets 21 working sets (1-2 shy of failure as Layne recommends) through dips, chest presses and shoulder presses over 7 days with very little rest between the workouts (~70h after upper power, ~46h after back/shoulders hyper and ~46h after chest/arms hyper).
And then there's chest, there is no way in hell that the pecs will recover in ~46h after 8 working sets and 6 sets of 3 reps with 65-70% of normal 3-5 rep max before getting hit again.
Im young, 24 years old, been lifting for ~5 years and if i take 6 sets (3x6-10 bench and 3x8-12 db flyes) to 1 rep shy of failure i need ATLEAST 3-3½ days of rest before i can hit that muscle again if i want to progress and stay whole, on a calorie surplus ofc.
If i up my frequency more with that intensity/volume my progress stalls and i get all kinds of minor injuries such as sprains and tendinitis.
So im curious, how can you natural lifters that follow this routine manage to recover?
Do you really take your sets to 1 rep from real failure?
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Frostshock private msg quote post Address this user
Basically, the first month or two of PHAT is DOMs HELL. You will be sore almost constantly. Now 7+ months in I rarely get sore and if I do it's only for a day or so. If I'm sore during a workout usually simply working that muscle with a lighter weight for a warmup set or two completely alleviates any soreness.

The Simplyshredded template is meant to be tampered with depending on your weak points or what you like. My shoulders are rarely sore but that's because I changed up the shoulder hyper portion to include work for the posterior delt as well as swapping out incline pressing.

As for chest, the speed sets have been hugely beneficial to my form and explosiveness from the bottom of the lift. I notice that pushing from my chest is BY FAR easier since I've started doing those.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rawsteel
So im curious, how can you natural lifters that follow this routine manage to recover?

Eating and sleeping really, once your body gets used to the heavy days and volume days I find that nothing really impedes your progressive overload.
I try to avoid repping to intentional failure - it will happen though. After a couple months you'll know what you can rep at what weight, so you just account for progressive overload and go from there. It's hard to explain avoiding and working around failure for the rep ranges without going into a huge spiel.
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Frostshock private msg quote post Address this user
If you're lazy and don't want to read all of that:

PHAT is hard, but your body gets used to the volume and power days eventually.
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Rawsteel private msg quote post Address this user
Ah ok, i wonder what Layne means with 1 rep shy of failure thought, does it mean that you stop your set when the next rep would result in failure (cant get the weight up no matter what) or the rep before that?
If it's the last one then how can you know when to increase the weight if you never push yourself to the limit (not failure but the one before)?
Also, what is the progression method in PHAT?
There's all kind of set rep ranges (3-5, 6-10 etc) but it doesn't say how to use these.
Do you start with a weight that you can perform for example exactly 5 reps with and keep it untill you reach 3 reps and then lower the weight to be able to work within the set rep range (increasing when able to do 6 in the first) or do you use the same weight through all the sets and increase it when you can stay within the set rep ranges in all the sets?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
The rep ranges are there so you can finish your sets within those reps. It's not an exact "5-4-3." In terms of when to move up, even if you don't go to failure, you should have a pretty good idea of, "I could do 2 more next time with this weight," or "last week I had to stop at 6 reps because 7 would have been failure, but this week, I got 8 and 9 would have been failure."

Not sure why you feel like recovery would be an issue. It isn't. -3X
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