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New programme: phat, ppl, etc12168

Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
Want to start a different well proven programme as my strength gains are terrible..

Might try using 5x5 on a major movement but i dont like the idea of doing low rep all the time so thats why im thinking PHAT aswell...

I was thinking maybe doing 5x5 compound then 2/3 complimentary movements at like 10 reps??

Maybe if anyone can link me or send some workout cards for PHAT, PPL or any programme they use?
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IrishGymSheep private msg quote post Address this user
Just do Westside.
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
Oh my god how did westside slip past my mind!

Thanks for response.

Sorry to whack another low importance thread on the site, i would of put it in my log but wanted some other peoples thoughts
Post 3 IP   flag post
tamere01 private msg quote post Address this user
How about West Side for Skinny Bastards?
Got the Pdf and heard good things about it.
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Youngbrah private msg quote post Address this user
I would definitely recommend phat, I think I probably saw better strength gains with that than even 5*5. Just change the layne norton one on here a bit, in my opinion its too much volume take out a lot of the accessory movements
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TyrannosaurusFlex private msg quote post Address this user
HST. 5 weeks in and loving every second!
Post 6 IP   flag post
Mikemadeofpeace private msg quote post Address this user
BBB Wendler is also pretty damn awesome!
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McQueef private msg quote post Address this user
Check out EKnight's Modified WSBB Routine:

clickable text
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leanr0x private msg quote post Address this user
go for abbreviated routines

less on time investment and it should build monsters^^
Post 9 IP   flag post
barrylol private msg quote post Address this user
Cycle smolov jr
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NJA82 private msg quote post Address this user
How heavy are you at the moment man? Have you run a consistent program for 12 months and gained a decent amount of weight? Worry about this before your strength, strength will come as you get bigger.
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
Im 61kg, been gainin weight slowly using a 4 day split but im getting weaker
Post 12 IP   flag post
NJA82 private msg quote post Address this user
how tall? man no offense but 61kg is bloody light, if your around 5`10 I would be aiming to get to at least 80kg before using any of the programs you mentioned, especially westside.

If your getting weaker its related to diet not your training at your current weight man, can pretty much guarantee you this 99%.

I would be doing something like Stronglifts, Allpro`s beginner program on BB.com or something along those lines and eat BIG for another year and see where you are at, can assure you once your upwards of 75kg and have spent a fair amount of time on a solid program your strength worries will be a in the past.
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
By diet do you mean im not eating enough?
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NJA82 private msg quote post Address this user
61kg... you are barely eating at all man, time to start eating 3500 or more calories per day, stick to 180-200g protein a day max and aim for around 100g fats and get the rest from carbs. Should be a good start, even doing this alone for a month with your current training program will make massive changes. Dont be afraid to put on a little bit of BF, no gains have ever come from undereating.
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pandasashi private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by NJA82
how tall? man no offense but 61kg is bloody light, if your around 5`10 I would be aiming to get to at least 80kg before using any of the programs you mentioned, especially westside.

If your getting weaker its related to diet not your training at your current weight man, can pretty much guarantee you this 99%.

I would be doing something like Stronglifts, Allpro`s beginner program on BB.com or something along those lines and eat BIG for another year and see where you are at, can assure you once your upwards of 75kg and have spent a fair amount of time on a solid program your strength worries will be a in the past.

this is total shit, dont listen to this. strength gains have little to do with size. richard hawthorne is 136lbs deadlifting 610lbs for 4 reps... and diet is more for bodybuilding goals...powerlifters dont have to eat as much as bodybuilders, strength gains are largely based on the nervous system, not sarc. hypertrophy
Post 16 IP   flag post
pandasashi private msg quote post Address this user
westside is probly the best pure strength program, GVT or similar programs are good for purely getting swole, phat is a perfect mix of both, 5X5 and HST are pretty good for both as well and are fun since ur doing multiple compounds (the fun stuff) in the same day...so its up to you but if strength is the goal, i would go with westside since it works like a beast, i mean just look at EK's bench records..
Post 17 IP   flag post
NJA82 private msg quote post Address this user
hahaha are you serious son? 61kg? and people are telling him to do westside and GVT? im outta here this is a bit of a joke now hahaha and powerlifters not having to eat as much as bodybuilders? Really? Must be the 140lb class powerlifters your talking about because most of the 200+lb powerlifters which is pretty much all of them eat well over 3000 calories per day if not a lot more.

Im trying to give the guy some solid advice that WILL make him stronger, whats the obsession with everyone wanting to be under 160lb`s these days?

Confuses me with all these people that struggle with strength and always are switching programs yet arent sure whether they are eating enough or not... If you are advanced enough to be messing around with westside and PHAT you would definitely want to have your nutrition squared away first.
Post 18 IP   flag post
pandasashi private msg quote post Address this user
yes im serious.
weight has nothing to with strength gains..yes, when ur heavier you have more potential for strenght but it still has nothing to do with strength gains.
op has been around here long enough to know a thing or two about nutrition, he is asking about a good program for strength and westside is a good one.
how much do you weigh and what are your lifts?
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
Im confused as hell now. Dont know wether to stay with 4 day split and pile on some mass or do my phat routine...
Post 20 IP   flag post
NJA82 private msg quote post Address this user
Dont have to pile on mass dude, just need to eat enough to make solid progress, if your lifts are stalling add another 200-300 calories per day and see how you go, once you stall again in the gym and on the scales add more.

It is very energy expensive for your body to make lean muscle mass, the majority of people require a fairly decent calorie surplus to make the body build muscle, genetics play a large role in this, some people can get away with making solid strength gains on little to no caloric surplus but most people with average genetics require a fair few calories over to get things happening.

As pandasashi said though you can gain strength without being big BUT no one will ever tell you that more muscle isnt going to make you stronger and look a lot more swole and tanked
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
So give current split more time and eat more then revisit if strength hasnt increased with more muscle mass?
Post 22 IP   flag post
NJA82 private msg quote post Address this user
has your current split worked for you up until now? If so yeap try exactly what you said! If it hasnt worked for you then possibly try something different but definitely make sure you are getting enough calories to promote good recovery and some lean muscle growth.
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
Its worked in terms of muscle developlment but very slowly. But like i said strength has decreased. Maybe i should reduce the volume
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pandasashi private msg quote post Address this user
op, there are basically two different types of programs out there that stimulate two different types of hypertrophy.
sarcoplasmic hypertrophy is achieved through bodybuilding paramaters (higher volume, 8+ rep range) this is how you gain the most weight and look swole..its a pump essentially..examples of programs are gvt and traditional bro splits...
myofibrilar hypertrophy is achieved through strength buildimg parameters (>5reps..this is making the actual muscle fibers bigger, you dont get big as fast but it is more dense and you get stronger faster..look at pics of elliott hulse compared to a bodybuilder and you will see the differance)..examples of programs are wsbb and 5x5...
given this info, make up your mind based on your goals..
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Hamer93 private msg quote post Address this user
Thanks pandasashi i think im gunna stick my routine for a further 3-4 weeks and try to gain a bit faster, maybe aim for atleast a pound a week then try Phat
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pandasashi private msg quote post Address this user
good luck buddy!
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NJA82 private msg quote post Address this user
Sounds like a solid plan dude!
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