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Shoulder/triceps/chest and back/legs/biceps?19302

Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Hey! I am a Novice lifter, lifted since january, and my lifts have increase well. But i am thinking about changing it a bit.

Will it work to do Chest/triceps/shoulders and then back/legs/biceps? Doing it 4 times a week, Monday-Tuesday-Off-Thursday-Friday-Off-Off? Would that work?
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The Dark
Knight
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Are you still progressing with the routine you’re on? If so, don’t change it.

If you feel like you need a change, wouldn’t do the one you suggested. Either push/pull/legs or upper/lower/upper/lower. -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Are you still progressing with the routine you’re on? If so, don’t change it.

If you feel like you need a change, wouldn’t do the one you suggested. Either push/pull/legs or upper/lower/upper/lower. -3X


Can i ask why u didnt like my spilt over? To much excercies at once, or? Its the same excercies as one a upper/lower, but i have divided it a bit different.
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The Dark
Knight
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Legs need their own day. If you have enough gas left in the tank to train anything else besides them, you’re not hitting them hard enough. -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Legs need their own day. If you have enough gas left in the tank to train anything else besides them, you’re not hitting them hard enough. -3X


I see, will not do it then. U have a point.

But beside upper/lower, is it some other good 4 day split routines, which involves training ur musclegroups twice a week?

Push/Pull/legs like u mention is good, but is a 5-6 day routine. I need a beginner/novice/intermediate 4 day routine, which involves the musclegroups as much as possible, so I can gain some musclemass as fast as possible. Brosplit is not a option, because it hit my back/shoulders/chest just once a week.
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The Dark
Knight
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What’s wrong with upper/lower? -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
What’s wrong with upper/lower? -3X


Nothing wrong with it, but i dont like to train my legs and lower body at one simple day, two times a week. Dont feel that i get enough pump in the upper part.
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The Dark
Knight
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Pump has nothing to do with progress. I don't understand what you mean when you state, "i dont like to train my legs and lower body at one simple day, two times a week.'

Are you aware that training systems like Westside Barbell have used a basic Upper/Lower split for decades to produce some of the strongest and jacked athletes in the world?

I assume since you've been a member here for over a year, you already know that, right? -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Pump has nothing to do with progress. I don't understand what you mean when you state, "i dont like to train my legs and lower body at one simple day, two times a week.'

Are you aware that training systems like Westside Barbell have used a basic Upper/Lower split for decades to produce some of the strongest and jacked athletes in the world?

I assume since you've been a member here for over a year, you already know that, right? -3X


But is upper/lower effectively for me? I really like the routine, because it involves my musclegroups twice a week. The routine i want to change to is This one, which is still a u/l, but here i will train my triceps twice a week, same with my biceps:

Monday: Benchpress, Military Press, Chins, Curls, Pushdown, Face pulls, Side Lateral Raise
Tuesday: Squat, Deadlift, Leg press, Calf Raises, Ab Work, Leg Curls
Wednesday: Off
Thursday: Benchpress, DB rows, Militarypress, Flyes, Pushdown, Face pulls
Friday: Same as Tuesday
Saturday and Sunday are off. 3x10 on every excerciese, will try to increase in weights every week.

Thoughts? Would that work?
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The Dark
Knight
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Why would it NOT work?

What you have set up is an upper/lower. Not a fan of the exercise selection, but that's just me.

How can you still be a novice, having been posting here for so long? -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Why would it NOT work?

What you have set up is an upper/lower. Not a fan of the exercise selection, but that's just me.

How can you still be a novice, having been posting here for so long? -3X


What do u mean by «not fan of the excerciese selection»? All the big compunded excercies are there, aswell as the others. What do u miss?
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The Dark
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OHP are not only an unnatural movement, but not even the best recruiter of the anterior delts. They’re just shoulder wreckers in general; I’m always shocked people still consider them a staple movement.

You have no unilateral movements for the lower body, no rotator cuff work, and in general, not enough back work as a whole. -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
OHP are not only an unnatural movement, but not even the best recruiter of the anterior delts. They’re just shoulder wreckers in general; I’m always shocked people still consider them a staple movement.

You have no unilateral movements for the lower body, no rotator cuff work, and in general, not enough back work as a whole. -3X


Huh? I thought OHP was one of the best shoulderexcercies out there? Look at Wendlers 531 program, he involves OHP in both of his upper days.

Not enough backwork? Chins, Face Pulls and DB Rows?
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The Dark
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Huh? No. Not enough back work. You need twice as much pull as push (ie 2X back vs pressing movements).

Idc what Wendler advises. He’s not a physiologist or in any way clinically based in his decisions.

Let me ask you two questions- 1) can you tell me the purpose of the anterior deltoid? And 2) do you know what is meant by the term “closed packed position of a joint?” -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Huh? No. Not enough back work. You need twice as much pull as push (ie 2X back vs pressing movements).

Idc what Wendler advises. He’s not a physiologist or in any way clinically based in his decisions.

Let me ask you two questions- 1) can you tell me the purpose of the anterior deltoid? And 2) do you know what is meant by the term “closed packed position of a joint?” -3X


Okok, u surely have more knowledge in this then me, so i will trust u. But if that upper/lower isnt good enough, what should i then go for? Like i said, i need a 4 day program, for beginner/intermediate.

What about this from Lyle, then? https://forums.lylemcdonald.com/showthread.php?t=1696

Or could u make one for me? I u could, i would appreciate it alot. U/l for example.
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The Dark
Knight
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Read the Routine design for Dummies thread. All in there. -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Read the Routine design for Dummies thread. All in there. -3X


Have read that multiple times.

But be real now, would a upper/lower be good for me? Or is it not effecient enough? Its between that or a brosplit.
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The Dark
Knight
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Not sure where your disconnect is. I said earlier that I specifically advised an upper/lower. Just not the one you set up. -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Not sure where your disconnect is. I said earlier that I specifically advised an upper/lower. Just not the one you set up. -3X


Ye i know u said that, but how should i then change it? U surely have alot more knowledge to setting it up alot more correctly. It will take u 5 min

What about this u/l from Lyle Mcdonald? Does it look better? https://forums.lylemcdonald.com/showthread.php?t=1696
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The Dark
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Yeah it will take me 5 minutes, but it won’t help you in the long run. Learn how to do it yourself and you’ll be better off. That’s why I directed you to the Routine Design thread. “Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you feed him for a lifetime” - Chinese proverb. -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
Yeah it will take me 5 minutes, but it won’t help you in the long run. Learn how to do it yourself and you’ll be better off. That’s why I directed you to the Routine Design thread. “Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you feed him for a lifetime” - Chinese proverb. -3X


quat: 3-4X6-8/3' (3-4 sets of 6-8 with a 3' rest)
SLDL or leg curl: 3-4X6-8/3'
Leg press: 2-3X10-12/2'
Another leg curl: 2-3X10-12/2'
Calf raise: 3-4X6-8/3'
Seated calf: 2-3X10-12/2'
Abs/low back: a couple of heavy sets apiece

Tue: Upper
Flat bench: 3-4X6-8/3'
Row: 3-4X6-8/3'
Incline bench or shoulder press: 2-3X10-12/2'
Pulldown/chin: 2-3X10-12/2'
Triceps: 1-2X12-15/1.5'
Biceps: 1-2X12-15/1.5'

Will go for this one, but which excercies should i choose for biceps/triceps? Should i go for triceps pushdown/curls on both of the upper days, or should i change?
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The Dark
Knight
eknight private msg quote post Address this user
O.








M.








G.



Dude, are you dense or a troll or what? You still have insufficient back work. Still no unilateral leg movement. Still considering an overhead press. I quit. Pick whatever routine and movements you want. You’re an adult. You don’t need someone else to tell you what to do because, clearly, you wouldn’t listen anyway. -3X
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
O.








M.








G.



Dude, are you dense or a troll or what? You still have insufficient back work. Still no unilateral leg movement. Still considering an overhead press. I quit. Pick whatever routine and movements you want. You’re an adult. You don’t need someone else to tell you what to do because, clearly, you wouldn’t listen anyway. -3X


How can I, as a Novice lifter know that? And yes, i have read ur dummies thread like 15 times now.

But a question, should i do heavy/upper/heavy/upper or heavy/heavy/heavy/heavy, when doing a u/l? The first is a hypertrophy one.
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Smash00 private msg quote post Address this user
Quote:
Originally Posted by eknight
O.








M.








G.



Dude, are you dense or a troll or what? You still have insufficient back work. Still no unilateral leg movement. Still considering an overhead press. I quit. Pick whatever routine and movements you want. You’re an adult. You don’t need someone else to tell you what to do because, clearly, you wouldn’t listen anyway. -3X


Sry for spam, what do u think about this one?

Squat 5 sets 10,10,8,6, 4 reps. SLDL 3 sets 10,10,10 reps, Calf Isolation 2-3 sets 12-15 reps.

Bench 5 sets, 10,10,8,6, 4 reps. Dips 3 sets 10,10,10. Tricep Isolation 2-3 sets 12-15 reps. Side Lateral Raises 2 sets 15 reps.

Deadlift 5 sets 10,10,8,6,4 reps. Chins 3 sets 10,10,10. Bicep Isolation 2-3 sets 12-15 reps. Read Lateral Raises 2 sets 15 reps.

One session follows another...Week 1 Squat, Bench, Deads, Squat. Week two Bench, Deads, Squat, Bench. Week 3 Deads, Squat, Bench, Deads. And so on.

Better?
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Jsn3004 private msg quote post Address this user
@eknight This guy is always trolling. Numerous accounts from the same IP address. i'd just let it go. It amazes me that someone is so bored and sad with their life that they decide to do shit like this.
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